The Original Shareware 1.1/The Original Shareware (WeMake CDs)(Volume 1.1)(CDs, Inc)(1993).iso/7/fax.zip/FAXSYS.THD

Text File | 1988-09-07 | 37KB | 1,153 lines

Collection of messages from CompuServe's IBM Communications (IBMCOM)
forum discussing FAX solutions for the PC user.  Included are ideas
for transferring text files to a FAX machine and user's reactions to
the various PC FAX adapter boards.  Download with a protocol and
unpack with ARC-E.  Edited - Ed Girou
-----------------------------------------------------------------



#: 101102     01-May-88  11:04:33
Fm: Jim Barthell 72606,335
To: All

Any thoughts/suggestions on uploading a text file to a FAX machine?
                                 Jim
                              72606,335




#: 101443     04-May-88  22:04:01
Fm: Tom Hawley 72157,1070
To: Jim Barthell 72606,335

You'll need software to convert the ASCII file to one of the Group 3
compression formats (either modified Huffman or modified READ), and
then a Group 3 compliant modem to handshake and communicate with the
fax machine.  Sorry, it can't be done with the usual PC comm
software/hardware!  Have a look at the article on fax boards for PC's
in last month's issue of Data Communications, or similar in the 25
April Infoworld.




#: 101469     05-May-88  01:18:18
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Tom Hawley 72157,1070

Tom,

just happened to see your last message on "FAX".  Do you happen to know
a black box with a serial port that can send and receive faxes, store
them in its own memory (perhaps 1 MB would be required) and down- and
upload them to and from a PC as soon as someone bothers to connect
black box - PC?

I somewhat dislike the idea of a fax card, not least because I would
prefer to switch my PC off or even take it away for some time.  It
would be great if such a black box could operate autonomously for some
time, say 24 hours.

Hans




#: 101673     06-May-88  21:21:08
Fm: Tom Hawley 72157,1070
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

An interesting concept:  the black box would, in essence, be a
standalone fax machine with no printing capability.  I don't know of
any such creature now on the market.  There are standalone fax units
that have RS232 ports and are designed to be used with PC's in the way
you suggest, but they're also fully functional by themselves (and more
expensive as well.)




#: 102379     12-May-88  21:39:09
Fm: James Hale 73220,1713
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

HansQuadram in Atlanta sells a portable fax similar in size to the
migent pocket modem.  It attaches to your serial port and your in
business.  I want to buy one for the office Toshiba laptop.  With that
little device and my normal modem I  can set up shop from anywhere.
DAK sells a modem buffer that you hookup between the external modem and
PC.  The beauty of the buffer is that it stays on all the time and is
ready to receive files with the usual xmodem protocol.  It flashes red
when it is storing an incoming message.  I am setting up one for the
office so that managers on trips can upload text files, spreadsheets,
etc. directly to the secretary's computer.  With this buffer the
computer doesn't have to be on. I think that it would be ideal if
Compuserve would set up a service so that text files could be uploaded
through Easyplex and the service would fax them to a designated number.
Do you think a service like that would be a hit?
                        Jim Hale exit




#: 102428     13-May-88  02:24:13
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: James Hale 73220,1713

James,

thanks for the Quadram fax hint.  Can this one work when the PC is off?

I believe a send fax service may be a good thing but a service to
replace your own fax machine would have to RECEIVE fax messages round
the clock.  The biggest technical problem for a service like CompuServe
or MCI (who will probably introduce a fax sending service later this
year) is to provide one telephone number for each subscriber.  Thus the
little black boxes may steal the show if they can operate with a
telephone on the same line and if they have enough memory to hold a few
fax messages until I switch my PC on again.

Hans




#: 102521     14-May-88  01:30:18
Fm: Brion Lutz 76137,365
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans,

I don't know if anyone mentioned it or not but EasyLink (and probably
other Email services) allow you to send a file from your computer to a
FAX machine. This save us time and typing and leaves our FAX available
for incoming.

Brion






#: 102634     15-May-88  00:41:23
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Brion Lutz 76137,365

Brion,

thanks for the info that Easylink already offers a fax sending service.
MCI Mail will probably introduce this also later this year.  However,
for low volume users like me RECEIVING faxes without having to install
a fax machine plus another telephone line would be the real
breakthrough.

Hans




#: 102654     15-May-88  07:50:46
Fm: Earle Robinson 70135,141
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

The trouble with the easylink service is that you have to pay a high
monthly fixed charge, which may not be worth it.  I too am interested
in what mci will offer in this regard.  However, I'm not all that happy
with mci's service.  I tried to reach them yesterday, saturday morning,
with a question.  No service on weekends!  How can a 24 hour network be
so shortsighted.  Could you imagine that you may not report a problem
to the telco on saturday?  Hardly!  And, you can reach compuserve any
time of day or night, any day of the week.  Of course, you need to know
a special 800 number of the off hours.   -er




#: 102697     15-May-88  17:38:26
Fm: Brion Lutz 76137,365
To: Earle Robinson 70135,141

Earle,

I don't think there is a fixed monthly charge on Easylink, there is a
minimum charge of $25/month but as long as you use the service a couple
hours a week you only pay for the actual services you use on EasyLink.
I noticed some complaints about MCI service on this thread so maybe the
minimum is worth it.  I guess Western Union figures it costs them
$350/yr to maintain mailbox and directory service whether a person uses
it or not.

I tested the FAX sending capability. It was a delayed transmission and
it got to the FAX machine about 15 minutes after I typed it.

You'd think Compuserve would be more into the Email business with all
those computers, local numbers and the Forum area experience it would
seem like a natural market for them.

Brion






#: 102712     15-May-88  20:04:33
Fm: Earle Robinson 70135,141
To: Brion Lutz 76137,365

The problem is for people, like me, whose use is highly erratic.  Thus,
the $25 per month does become a fixed charge several months.  For that
reason I prefer mci, in spite of its weaknesses.

The problem with cis email is that it can take a half hour or more for
a message to reach your own host due to the split host system.  Also,
you may find your host down for protacted periods, as I did on last
thursday & friday. I'm afraid cis is captive of their original design.
Obviously, if they were doing it from scratch today, they would do
things very differently.  I also like mci for telexes rather than cis
because you do have your own number, and your correspondents don't have
to interface knowlingly with mci.  I'm afraid that fax would have the
same weakness here.   -er




#: 102740     16-May-88  07:34:22
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Earle Robinson 70135,141

By the way, AT&T Mail has introduced fax transmission service, and
their fixed monthly cost (about $1.50 per month per mailbox) is
substantially less than EasyLink's.  They also have telex, hardcopy
output, _and_ access to the worldwide Unix electronic mail system.
Very nice.

       -- Toby




#: 102784     16-May-88  15:52:31
Fm: Earle Robinson 70135,141
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

I talked to them today.  In fact, the annual fee is $30, not $18 as you
said. But, it does seem interesting.   -er




#: 102695     15-May-88  16:45:37
Fm: Brion Lutz 76137,365
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans,

Yes it would be nice if services like Easylink and MCI could offer two
way FAX service.  I know when I send FAX'es via Easylink the "files"
are stored on an intermediate machine, don't see why they can't store
incoming FAX's as messages or files to be downloaded from the
"mailbox".  Of course, I'm the guy who is waiting for the 4-in-one
Laser Printer/Copier/FAX/OCR machine <grin>, so there is probably a
good technical reason they don't offer two-way FAX's yet.

Ability of the third party Email company to store the FAX message for
periodic downloading would eliminate anyone getting a busy siganl when
calling your FAX number and with it the need for a second phone line.

Brion

Brion






#: 109458     23-Jul-88  18:43:04
Fm: Vasos Panagiotopoulos 76530,1430
To: [F] All

Does any one know of any public domain (or otherwise) batch
MS-DOS-Generic program that translates an ASCII text file into G3-FAX
so that it can be sent as a vanilla upload to a fax via a
Hayes-compatible modem. (You should note that my MS-DOS-Generic AMPRO
2210 does not have any video, keyboard, or communications RAM.  Only
vanilla BIOS calls are tolerated.) Please cc reply to my id, not just
forum. Thanks so much/vjp2




#: 109511     24-Jul-88  09:43:52
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Vasos Panagiotopoulos 76530,1430

Vasos------there is software that converts ASCII text files into the
Fax format, that's how "The Complete Fax" board (10" plug in
board--works great) and several similiar products work.  The problem
with what you are contemplating is the incompatibilty of a fax modem an
a Hayes type modem. They do not speak the same language.  To
successfully communicate with a fax machine, you must use a fax modem.

Dan






#: 109773     26-Jul-88  08:46:32
Fm: Gerald Meier 73240,2046
To: Vasos Panagiotopoulos 76530,1430

Vasos,

Looking for the same ... Tell me if you have found one. I know a
faxmodem which has both Hayes _and_ Fax inside. Look for Lightspeed --
> Taiwan

Gerald Liechtenstein, Europe






#: 110189     28-Jul-88  14:16:04
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Gerald Meier 73240,2046

Gerald,

there was a pc-fax comparison about some 10 different devices in the
June 28 issue of PC Magazine. They favored the Quadram JT Fax which is
available as a plug in card and also as a stand-alone unit. They said
it was the only one that made a "finished product" impression. And it
was by far the cheapest as well.

Hans

(English this time)




#: 110297     29-Jul-88  10:25:53
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans----Before buying a fax card, I inquired about the -JT Fax- by
Quadram and -The Complete Fax- by The Complete PC.  You are correct
about the price in that both mail order and retail price for the JT Fax
is less.

I bought the -The Complete Fax- for several reasons, the valility of
which may be questionable.  If I recall correctly the speed on The
Complete Fax is 9600 and the JT Fax 4800 and The Complete Fax can
operate in the background and the JT Fax can not.  For anyone
considering such a device please verify the speed and background
information independently as I may have misinterpreted the information
I got.

The same company (The Complete PC) has another product, The Complete
Answering Machine (CAM), that can distinguish between voice and fax
transmissions and route the call accordingly, if you have need for such
an arrangement.  The fax board does everything that I expected it to
do.

What do you/they mean by a finished product?

Dan






#: 110298     29-Jul-88  10:40:43
Fm: Jim Rutt 71410,3141
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Any one found a FAX board maker that supplies OS/2 driver? ::: Jim Rutt
:::




#: 110392     30-Jul-88  01:09:01
Fm: Larry Brown 73210,2155
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Dan,
       I have the CAM and was wondering about TCF. Both would be on the
same phone line. Who answers? CAM? Then, when it hears a Fax
transmission, does it switch to FAX? Wow!
       Also, what word processor do you have to use? Are graphics
possible? A Fax would sure speed up transmission of my reports
(especially expense reports <grin>) to headquarters.
       Thanks for any information you can give me.

       Larry




#: 110501     31-Jul-88  10:01:19
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Larry Brown 73210,2155

Larry----The CAM answers and directs the call to the fax if it is a fax
transmission.

I use Professional Write 2.0 from Software Publishing.  Yes you can use
graphics (ie. Dr Halo etc.).  The fax board works as expected and is
very easy to set up.

Dan






#: 110517     31-Jul-88  13:08:49
Fm: Larry Brown 73210,2155
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Dan,
       Do you export the Professional Write file in ASCII, or can the
FAX read word processr documented files. If so, which ones.
Specifically, does it read WordPerfect files. I know, leave you alone
and call The Complete PC <grin>.

       Thanks,
       Larry




#: 110771     02-Aug-88  07:27:38
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Larry Brown 73210,2155

Larry----I do export files in ASCII, however it will take WP files.
With PW 2 you can save the file in a number of formats, one of which is
WP, I just happen to do it in ASCII.

Dan




#: 110619     01-Aug-88  08:07:21
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Dan,

thanks a lot for your info! Quadram now seems to have a 9600 version as
well. For low volume users this may not be important though.

Your info on The Complete Answering Machine (an answering machine/fax
combination that can differentiate between different kinds of incoming
calls) is very interesting for me. Would you mind giving me the address
of that company?

PC Mag wrote that all of the products except JT-Fax made a somewhat
unfinished impression, as if the products were rushed to market before
their development was really finished. I only cited them.

Hans




#: 110779     02-Aug-88  08:53:50
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans------"The Complete Answering Machine" and "The Complete Fax" are
two different 3/4 length (10") cards.  They do work together in that
The Complete Answering Machine can answer the phone and determine if
the call is a fax or voice transmission and route the call accordingly.
I just wanted to clarify that they are two separate cards. The address
is:

The Complete PC 521 Cottonwood Drive Milpitas, California 95035

FAX: [phone] Voice: [phone]

Ref:"the products were.........finished".  I have had no trouble or
found any bugs in mine.

Dan






#: 110431     30-Jul-88  12:45:54
Fm: Gerald Meier 73240,2046
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans-Georg,

I've read a product comparisation in Infoworld which said that the
Panasonic fax boards are quite good! JT Fax wasn't looking good there!
So I am a little bit mixed up with those infos. I am still waiting and
looking what happens here. It seems that this FAX-Board wave is still
to come ...

Gruss Gerald






#: 110620     01-Aug-88  08:07:48
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Gerald Meier 73240,2046

Gerald and all,

generally I still find this black box fax ideal. It has lots of memory
and a very important little red light which lights up when the thing
has swallowed a fax from the telephone line.

The big thing is that it does its job of sending and receiving faxes
even when the PC is switched off or not connected. You later connect
the PC and suck the faxes out through a serial connection. When the
last one has been sucked the red light extinguishes.

Oh, and the super version also has a button. When you pick up the
telephone and hear a fax beep on the other end you press that button,
drop the receiver and receive that fax. (When you don't lift the
receiver at all the black box picks it up after the sixth ring or so.
If there's no fax it speaks a polite message and hangs up. Or does it
even record voice as well?)

The only problem is that no one has ever made that box.

But I can see wonderful products, based on fax, in the not so distant
future. When does someone create a mail and file transfer standard for
fax machines?

Hans




#: 110780     02-Aug-88  08:53:59
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans-----If you are going to leave the 'box' switched on, you may as
well leave the PC on.  Ref: "When you pick......receive that fax", "The
Complete Fax" can do that altho depending on what you are doing in the
foreground it may take more than one keystroke.  Most incoming fax's
give you approximately 30 seconds to do your dance.  You can set it to
pick up on the first thur eighth ring.

Dan

P.S.  Ref: But I can........distant future".  I would not be surprised
if in 5-8 years there are as many fax-phones in homes as there are
VCR's once the general public understands what you can do with them.

One of the local discount department stores sells them along side of
the answering machines, telephones, typewriters etc.  They had one on
sale for $899. last week.  That could of course be $199. if the volume
of sales matched that of VCR's.






#: 111025     04-Aug-88  05:04:35
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Dan,

thank you for the address. I will inquire for info there.

I cannot leave the PC on because it is a portable, and I take it with
me pretty often. The fax "black box" would remain and receive and send
faxes meanwhile. I still like that idea.

Quite clearly a fax does not need a separate telephone line unless you
have heavy traffic. If the fax picks up only after several rings that
would be fine. Ideally, of course, a voice should be routed to an
answering machine. If I am there a big "FAX" button should switch the
call to the fax if I get beeped at. Strangely enough, many fax makers
do not seem to see this opportunity (The Complete.. apparently does).
This is important for the private fax market. People will eventually
come to this same conclusion. And I am sure this is THE telecomm
product for the masses.

Hans




#: 111062     04-Aug-88  15:08:47
Fm: Vic Cruder 70426,601
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans--
       I just caught the tail end of this thread so forgive me if my
comments are redundant.  I'm a traveling salesman (4 days a week) who
often must send/recieve Fax, so I've been looking for a combination
Answering/FAX machine.  NEC makes one called a NEFAX 3EX, with a number
of useful features like phone, 50 number memory, confidential ( with
another NEC FAX) transmission, activity report, Group3,2,(optional)1
compatibility, 5 document auto-feeder, portable (110 VAC), timer, and
halftone reprod.  The answering machine can be set for voice or fax or
automatic which will switch to fax if the call is not voice.  It all
sounds great, the one point that it lacks which is critical for me is
that it does not allow remote operation like most answering machines.
One must go to the machine to retrieve messages.  Price is $2395.  The
salesman I talked with really could't tell me too much about the unit
as it is very new.  I'll just have to wait 'til someone comes up with a
stand alone FAX/Answering machine as I don't want to load up my
computer with a bunch of boards and then be able only to send (no
scanner for input).

                               Vic




#: 111069     04-Aug-88  18:38:28
Fm: Frank Haber 72115,232
To: Vic Cruder 70426,601

Another similar unit is the Panasonic Panafax KX-F115 combo
telephone/answering machine/fax.  Under $1300 street.  It's a bit big
to stuff in your suitcase (is this what you want?), and no halftone,
but it does have beeperless remote.

 Agreed on the limited usefulness of fax boards.  Around here, fax is
wiping out datacomm as people breathe a sigh of relief and stop trying
to teach semi-skilled office personnel the mysteries of computer
communications.  In addition to the classic pastrami-sandwich fax of
song and story (yes, in NY midtown offices it's common to see
secretaries faxing lunch orders), someone saw a hotdog cart on the
street, ordinary except for its unshaven owner, who was taking delivery
orders on his cellular phone.




#: 111224     06-Aug-88  01:30:38
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Vic Cruder 70426,601

Vic,

thanks a lot for your info on the NEC 3EX fax. This sounds
like the thing I need. Only I would like to feed it ASCII
files through the serial port which it may not have. But I
think some machines have or can have a serial port. If you
hear or rea something to that effect, please let me know.

Hans




#: 111400     07-Aug-88  20:34:58
Fm: Vic Cruder 70426,601
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Hans--
       I looked over the literature that came with the proposal, but
there was no information regarding the capability of directly sending
ASCI files. You may wish to call NEC.  Their phone number is
1-800-STARFAX ( real cute ).
                                       Vic






#: 110638     01-Aug-88  10:28:58
Fm: Bill Gordon 76010,3466
To: Kenneth Hendrick 76370,1552

Could you tell me what model of the Sharp machine you got?  Thanks.
-bg




#: 110874     02-Aug-88  21:17:27
Fm: Dave Streit 76067,1265
To: Bill Gordon 76010,3466

Bill, my office (and a friend of mine with an office at home) use
Panasonic Panafax machines.  If you want model numbers, let me know and
I'll get them.







#: 110937     03-Aug-88  10:05:11
Fm: Bill Gordon 76010,3466
To: Dave Streit 76067,1265

Thank you.  I'd appreciate the model numbers if it's not too much
trouble. -bg




#: 110961     03-Aug-88  14:46:11
Fm: Dave Streit 76067,1265
To: Bill Gordon 76010,3466

Bill, one of our departments uses a Panasonic Panafax UF600.

Our telecommunications room has three Panasonic Panafax machines;
models UF400AD, UF250, and UF400.

One of my closest friends bought a Panafax recently, but I don't know
the model number (I just phoned him, but he is not home).






#: 111091     04-Aug-88  22:04:42
Fm: Harris Graves 70167,1426
To: Bill Gordon 76010,3466

Bill,
   I looked at a bunch of Fax machines and finally bought the Sharp FO
300. I won't be doing a *lot* of faxing, but this seems to have
everything I need.  It will send at 9600 bps, is compatable with groups
2 and 3 as well as 6 min, acts as a telephone, will reduce as needed,
can feed up to 10 sheets, has auto dial for fax and phone up to 70
numbers.
   Can buy it in shoppers advantage on the mall for $1177, but I was
able to get the local dealer to sell it to me for $1265, worth it to me
for the added support and set up (also for same day delivery).
    Harris




#: 111137     05-Aug-88  08:48:51
Fm: Bill Gordon 76010,3466
To: Harris Graves 70167,1426

Thanks, Harris.  That sounds like the best one yet.  I'm out in the
middle of nowhere (Grand Junction, CO), and I'll have to find one by
mail order. This kind of feedback really helps.  -bg




#: 111306     06-Aug-88  23:22:44
Fm: Harris Graves 70167,1426
To: Bill Gordon 76010,3466

Bill,
   Glad it was of some help.  In regards to mail order, beware of
ordering from the photography houses in New York.  They *seem* to have
the best prices, but I had a bad experience with Cambridge Photo.
Ordered the fax at a price of $1089 and asked for UPS Blue label
service.  They charged an extra $35 for that, which I suppose wasn't
too bad for the weight, but it had not arrived after 6 days.  When I
called (not toll free) to ask about the order, they said the *one*
person who knew about it was gone for three days.  They also said it
had been shipped.  When it did not arrive the next day, I called again
to cancel the order and they hung up on me.  So, I wrote a letter
cancelling.  There has still not been a delivery after two weeks, so I
don't think they intended to send it.  But, I'll bet I see a charge on
my Visa card.  Then I'll have to argue some more.
   Suggest you order from a reliable computer mail order at a slightly
higher price (after all, anybody can offer a low price if they don't
intend to deliver), or from Shoppers Advantage (that takes at least two
weeks for delivery, though).
   Drop me a note if I can help any other way.
      Harris




#: 110776     02-Aug-88  08:09:10
Fm: Jim Rutt 71410,3141
To: ALL

Anyone have any excperience with PC FAX boards such as GammaFAX, DEST,
QUadram, or Panasonic???? Are they reliable?  DO any have OS/2
Drivers???" ::: Jim Rutt :::




#: 111784     10-Aug-88  20:17:50
Fm: N. TOYOSHIMA 76662,330
To: all

One of my friends in New York is looking for a good fax board but I
don't
know what are really available in U.S.   I hope somebody can help me
find
out.

Every day, he sends the same info. to 200 clients.  Now, he prints out
and
he sends it manually.  The info. he sends out is come from some
original
software from company mainframe or PC.  (I don't know the details
now...)
Anyway, I assume he wants to send the info on the screen to 200
clients.
Is there any good fax board for such purpose?  Is there any good
software
house or third party which can consult him in New York?
I appreciate any comments on this.  Thanks.   --- Nobo  [Tokyo, Japan]




#: 111829     11-Aug-88  09:09:42
Fm: HOWARD MARKS 72241,33
To: N. TOYOSHIMA 76662,330

He could use a GAmmafax and program it to send to the 200 addresses.
Its not too difficult if you've done it before.

 - howard




#: 112022     12-Aug-88  20:23:58
Fm: N. TOYOSHIMA 76662,330
To: HOWARD MARKS 72241,33

Howard--

Thanks for the info.  Where can I (or he) find more info on
GAmmafax and the program?  Magazines, dealers, or manufacturers?

--Nobo







#: 111972     12-Aug-88  13:02:58
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: All

Looking for someone who knows fax inside out:

Does group 3 fax transmission include error correction?

While I'm at it, how do those fax machines communicate anyway? It seems
strange that these wonderful and obviously very reliable modems that
have rapidly become a worldwide standard should not be used for other
(computer) purposes as well, like for example, file transfer (but
without tying up the PC, if possible). Why are their modems so
different?

Imagine that a fax machine could have an electronic mail option, a
little memory and a serial port. Perhaps when that happens MCI Mail and
all the others will have to pack up? (Not CompuServe, because I cannot
imagine a fax with a forum option, but who knows...)

Hans (trying to gaze into the future again)




#: 112191     13-Aug-88  23:02:20
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

Lets see if I can handle your questions in order.

Group 3 fax does not include error correction.  However, in the last study
period CCITT Study Group VIII finalized what is going to be called informally
"Group 3 1/2" fax (T.30bis), which DOES include the ability to automatically
request retransmission of bad blocks. Machines supporting Group 3 1/2 will
interwork with machines that do not have retransmission capability, but of
course in those cases you won't actually have error control. Group 4 fax is
currently being studied; it will define a totally digital fax for use on ISDN
at 64000bps, and will, of course, have complete error control.

Fax machines use a variety of different modem techniques with various tolerance
for noise.  They use V.21 (300bps) for negotiation and status message
exchanges), V.29 for high-speed, and V.27 for medium speed transfers.  They
automatically test the line at the beginning of the connection to determine the
highest speed possible which acheives the desired bit error rate.  The modem
modulations used are optimized for _half-duplex_ operation (because fax is
usually sent only one-way at a time), but modems for PC and data use or
normally full-duplex; that's the main reason why PCs and faxes use different
modems.

There is work just starting in the USA to define a standard technique for
sending files using fax modems, which we hope to take to the CCITT once it is
complete.  As it is today, there are several PC fax board vendors who have
proprietary techniques, but few if any of them interwork with boards from other
vendors.

(continued...)




#: 112192     13-Aug-88  23:02:34
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

(continuing...)

Regarding an "electronic mail" option on fax machines:  there are, existing
today, fax machines with very sophisticated computer interfaces.  They can
receive fax images, store them on disk, and forward them to other destinations;
deliver to several destinations on a schedule; allow other fax machines to call
in and retrieve messages on request; allow the editing of images before
printing, etc.  There are also eletronic mail services (AT&T Mail is one
example) which allow you to send email messages to fax machines; they take your
text message, generate a fax image of it, and call the number you give.  It's
very interesting, I tell you, to be able to send the same exact message to
different people simultaneously via email, UUCP, telex, fax, and voicemail
(yes, AT&T Mail will READ the message to you if you don't have any other way to
receive it!).

Personally, I prefer to receive things from other people as email or other TEXT
forms rather than fax, unless of course it is pictures.  Why?  Because that way
I can easily (without rekeying) include that information into other documents
or messages, forward it to others (including on different systems), massage it
with editors, etc.  I can't do this very easily with a fax, which is DOTS, not
editable characters.

Anyway, people ARE thinking along the same lines as you, and you should see
some of your "wishes" come true before too long (in a standard way...)

       -- Toby




#: 112558     17-Aug-88  04:05:22
Fm: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

Toby,

thanks a lot for your explanation. This is the information I was longing for.
It was especially interesting to read about the move towards error correction
and the file transfer news. Things seem to move in the direction I was hoping
for.

When I mentioned electronic mail I meant text mail, not fax image mail. I am
aware that fax, as it is today, already is something like a new form of
electronic mail. But, quite obviously, when sender as well as recipient use a
computer, the text to dots conversion and vice versa is undesirable. Thus,
ideally, the fax machine should keep the text file, inquire about each
recipient's wishes, and send text or image as desired, or perhaps even a mixed
file format. (This is probably the far future, but perhaps some fax producer
reads this and likes the idea.)

I have seen an ad for a fax modem. No fancy fax board, just presumably a V.29
modem with everything else that fax requires. (Comes from Asia somewhere,
Gerald Meier 73240,2046 COMPUTERDIENST carries it.) How about a fax option for
the Hayes modems? If no one at Hayes has at least thought about this I would be
really surprised. My old wish would be something with enough memory to work on
its own for some time with the computer detached, battery backup, etc.,
needless to say more.

Hans




#: 112571     17-Aug-88  10:50:39
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Hans G. Michna 74776,2361

There are a number of companies that are providing fax modems.  The most well
known is Gammafax, because they've been in the business a while, but Everex and
Quadram are also now selling them, and there are more that I can't remember
right now.

The advanced technology Hayes uses in their current modems is capable of doing
the fax modulation, but to date the company has not decided to provide that
feature.  Personally, I use my Hayes modem to send faxes today -through AT&T
Mail.

       -- Toby




#: 113322     24-Aug-88  06:36:13
Fm: Ted Johnson 72047,3414
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

Toby,

I am fascinated by AT&T E-Mail.  I am a lawyer who must work extensively on
weekends.  I prefer to work at home whenever possible.  My computer makes this
possible in many instances because I am connected to the major legal databases
which allows me to do meaningful legal research at home.  I have even
considered a home fax machine so that I could send drafts to lawfirms that do
not have a modem equipped PC. (These projects are almost always joint efforts.)
Frankly, I have been unable to justify the cost since we have several fax
machines at the office. However, if there is a simple, relatively inexpensive
way to send E-Mail to a fax machine that would be wonderful.  How expensive is
AT&T E-Mail and how do I get more information on it?

                       Thanks,
                                  TED




#: 113324     24-Aug-88  07:34:57
Fm: Guruka Singh Khalsa 71500,34
To: Ted Johnson 72047,3414

Ted -
   You can send fax right here from EasyPlex.  GO EASY and enter: HELP FAX.
To get all the details.                                               .....G





#: 113580     26-Aug-88  04:59:56
Fm: Ted Johnson 72047,3414
To: Guruka Singh Khalsa 71500,34

Thanks to all for the news that CompuServe has instituted a FAX service via
E-Mail.  I tested it this morning by attempting to send a message to the
office.  I hope the CompuServe test is successful since, in my case, it should
be useful.

                               TED




#: 113343     24-Aug-88  10:18:38
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Ted Johnson 72047,3414

Actually, Ted, I just found out a couple of days ago that CompuServe is now
testing fax output capability!  Just GO EASY enter HELP FAX to get more
information on it.  The cost is very similar to AT&T Mail.  I haven't tested it
yet, but am planning on doing that today.

If you want more info on AT&T Mail anyway, you can reach them at 1-800-MAIL672.

       -- Toby






#: 113416     24-Aug-88  22:58:53
Fm: John Price 75040,10
To: Ted Johnson 72047,3414

Western Union's EASYLINK service has fax sending ability at $.55 for the first
half page and $.35 for each additional half page, anywhere in the US. Foreign
countries cost more, presumably for the phone charges.

WU is supposedly looking into fax RECEIVING for its customers.  I was told the
technology is there and works, but the glitch was how to bill a
non-customer/sender.

E-plex has been covered in other replies. jp




#: 112270     14-Aug-88  14:04:00
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

Toby-----Ref:"As it is today,.........from other vendors".  I use "The Complete
Fax" board from "The Complete PC", sending and receiving 15 to 20 fax's each
day (none of which go to similar equipment) with no difficulty. If it's group
III compatible, then it's group III compatible.

If the bulk of what you fax out is generated on your word processor, then you
may find a fax card more useful than a fax machine.

Dan






#: 112358     15-Aug-88  12:11:05
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Ah, but you misunderstood what I was saying.  Yes, PC fax boards will send and
receive FAX IMAGES, but the gentleman had inquired about FILE TRANSFER using
fax modems.  Obviously, the Group III standards apply when sending and
receiving images, but there are NO standards for file transfer via facsimile
modems, and all manufacturers have come up with incompatible techniques.

       -- Toby




#: 112424     15-Aug-88  21:45:04
Fm: Dan Johnson 76456,1010
To: Toby Nixon 70271,404

Toby-----I knew when I replied to your message that I was in your back yard but
thought I would roll the dice anyway.  By "FILE TRANSFER" do you mean binary
file transfer as opposed to "Lawyer43" (as in letter #43 to the attorney) file
transfer?

Dan






#: 112570     17-Aug-88  10:50:31
Fm: Toby Nixon 70271,404
To: Dan Johnson 76456,1010

Yes, exact binary file transfer from a file stored on one PC's disk to the
other PC's disk, the same way you do today with a regular PC modem and XMODEM
protocol (well, but XMODEM is not a good example; say YMODEM or ZMODEM because
they preserve the file length exactly).

That is different than taking a text file on disk, converting it to a fax
image, and sending it to a regular fax machine -- and there are no standards on
how to do it.

       -- Toby